RBTI Introduction Video – Challen Waychoff

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Pip and I will be leaving Wheeling on Friday to tour around New York and New Jersey (starting Friday in Rochester).  Pippa will bring a test kit with her and is willing to swing by and test anyone in the area that is interested, as well as go over all the intricate details of Challen’s program for a reasonable fee.  I’ll be there to make fart noises in several creative ways, do impressions, say GARRRR every time she looks at the refractometer, and otherwise annoy her.  I’ll write more about this tomorrow.  If you are an individual or alternative health practitioner of some kind in the area and know that you are definitely interested you can start the process of lining up an appointment by sending her an email at pipparoni@yahoo.com.
I say all this now because I probably won’t be busting out any big articles while we are gone, but I do hope to keep pumping out short video clips of Challen – the myth, the legend… each day – or when I get a chance.  You can see the first one right here.  I think he did a pretty good job at introducing the basic concept behind the RBTI, the meaning of some of the numbers, and the kind of approach he takes.
Before you hastily nitpick every phrase or try to bust his balls over the details, realize that no one here is trying to proclaim Challen as the almighty guru of all things health.  He is not.  No one is.  What Challen offers is a powerful tool to add to the toolbox – especially for those in desperate circumstances that simply can’t stabilize their body chemistry enough to digest and metabolize food efficiently enough to heal themselves.  The system is, in many ways, very advanced.  And, for the most part, very straightforward, simple, easy, predictable, and oftentimes extraordinarily quick depending on the situation.  Anyway, here’s “THE WHIZARD…”




  1. Looks like no video attached to post?

  2. Meh, it gives an error. gonna try it on Youtube instead.

  3. Great insight into the world your experiencing Matt. Thanks

  4. Matt can you explain how the numbers were arrived at? How did Ream's know those numbers were the "perfect" numbers?

  5. Not sure Tierney. Reams was a weirdo for sure. Says he was fasting and God told him. Reassuring huh?

    But of course it did come out of his mind, and it did come from his extensive work with soil and agriculture and animal science – knowing the importance of pH, conductivity, minerals, and so forth.

    The pH of 6.4 is considered the point where anionic and cationic energies are perfectly in balance – and energy production is maximal.

    I don't know too much about the rest. I'm working from acknowledging the validity of the results, and going backwards from there to figure it out. Like the opposite of the typical flow of most nutritional science.

    But in synch with other sciences – like acknowledging that gravity exists and then going about trying to figure out why that force exists, how it works, and why.

  6. Matt,

    From Taubes-Guyenet post, where did you get the idea that women have faster metabolisms than men? Are you referring to what you've seen with temperature, or is there a study that suggests it (either calories burned per bodyweight or temperature)?

    I think women oxidize more fat [vs glucose] than men, and fat oxidation increases uncoupling proteins, which could be why.

  7. ok, this I like: "What Challen offers is a powerful tool to add to the toolbox – especially for those in desperate circumstances that simply can't stabilize their body chemistry enough to digest and metabolize food efficiently enough to heal themselves. " A-effing-men. Right where I am and soooo hoping that this is gonna help me stabilize.

    Also, I know it seems weird and suspicious that Reams came up with this stuff the way he did but as an artist who lives to cultivate that lightening bolt of inspiration, I have to say I am totally comfortable with it. Not all of life can be so simply picked apart and explained. And I am super glad for that. It's beautiful as far as I am concerned.

  8. Long time no see you in video. It's nice to see you've embraced looking all rednecky and WVian-y. You know I love you. It just amazes me how beefy you look compared to the banner above.

    Love the part about how I'll get violently ill if I do RBTI. I'm sure that will convince many to try it! Lucky I've been thru liver detox before, and even tho I was really sick before I did it, I never got more than some headaches and yucky feelings. It doesn't have to be as bad as he says.

    So you're still pretty on board with the effectiveness of RBTI, then? And do you feel after more investigation that an RBTI like diet (eat early, no sweets, limit no foods, etc etc) is a good permanent way of life, much like keeping O6 lower, or a temporary tool to get on track?

    Shower us with more info. And please come do the tour of HI!

  9. Love the gravity analogy… just because the natives believed the volcano erupting was caused by an angry Goddess doesn't mean that the volcano didn't really erupt! Same thing. Just because Reams believed (take your pick of wackiness) doesn't mean the practice doesn't work.

    And Challen's not as goofy looking as you led us to believe. Would that I look so good at that age.

  10. my next roadtrip is to see challen someday!!!


  11. Thanks for doing this video Matt. It's good to put a face with the guy I've talked to on the phone.

  12. Challen seems to be very bright and articulate. He looks very fit, healthy, robust and lucid.

    Tell us more!

  13. Matt, interesting video, looking forward to the rest. However, your last answer to my question left me even more confused. I've been incorporating some of the tips from Challen's books and from the RBTI forum, but if I had to go to the clinic to get the real deal, then it's pretty hopeless for me because I have neither the financial or physical capability(due to my crippling condition) to go to Wheeling. If you and Pippa do figure out the secret sauce and do come to the Big Island of Hawaii, I would also be interested.

  14. Great video, loved it. I agree, Challen does look good. How old is he?

  15. Doug N, you can order the testing kit necessary to run your own numbers where you are at, then you can consult with Challen on the phone. This is what many people do (including myself) who may never make it out to Wheeling for an in-person consult. FYI.

  16. Matt,

    I just got my test kit from Challen the other day. Do you think I should spend a couple weeks adhering to the "foods to avoid" list and doing the 3 things he mentioned in this video prior to doing my first test? Seemed like a good idea to me because it would be a head start so to speak.

  17. I'm pretty confused as I thought distilled water was the worst thing to drink because it somehow demineralizes a person. I assumed that this wouldn't happen with RBTI because of the supplements a person would take, but in this video, he says that all she did was change her diet and drink distilled water. I live in an area with really soft water and am always worried it's affecting my mineral status. Any insight about the distilled/mineralization topic?

    I find this whole RBTI/Challen thing fascinating and am curious to see if you'll be able to demystify it into something more usable and understandable. Especially since it would be great to have an heir to this kind of information. I'm sure Challen can't live forever!


  18. Based on the descriptions of Challan I had gotten I was picturing someone more like Santa Claus. This guy looks pretty healthy to me. Maybe a bit heavy, but positively lean as a bean by People of Wal*Mart standards.

    I'm definitely going to have to get his books. Shame the high level ones are so pricey, but I guess I'll start at the beginning and see how it goes. Good video.

  19. i have read somewhere that grains have something in them that cause the body to react like it would opium. this past week i've switched from potatoes to brown rice and noticed my insomnia has gone away. in fact, i'm actually a wee bit sleepier than normal. so much, that i just took a 4 hour nap. i feel great, i'm just looking for a possible explanation as to why i've been taking so many naps lately.


  20. Challen is in his early 60s. He told me his age, but I can't remember exactly. I know he is a few years younger than my dad. :o)

  21. Wow, thanks for this. I want to get to WV, but this is the next best thing!

  22. GLS, I am considering buying the kit, however Pippa's case gives me pause. She apparently needed to go to the clinic to get significant results, and Im afraid I might be in that same category. Plus, I wonder about the seeming contradictions between the diet at the clinic and the RBTI basics described by Challen, Reams and others. I've started adapting my diet to those basics and started taking some of the neutral supplements. I'm used to strict diets,so the no foods are no problem,if they really are "no" foods. Some of the yes foods may be more of a challenge. My problem may be like Pippa's, in that I'm always trying too hard to eat healthy.

  23. Thanks for posting Matt! I find this RBTI stuff very fascinating.

    I'm still curious about the safety of drinking distilled water, especially from plastic bottles. I know Dr. Mercola thinks its a bad idea as does David Getoff from the Price-Pottenger Foundation.


    Does supplementing with the recommended minerals counteract these supposed "dangers"?

    Can a patient get by with drinking Reverse Osmosis water instead?

    Any thoughts?

  24. For those of you interested in doing RBTI, I recommend that you DO NOT read Challen's books.

    I'm waiting for my RBTI kit to arrive, but I've already read through the intro books. And let me say that these books make Challen look pretty bad. LOL

    You know who he reminds me of? Aajonus Vanderplanitz (who I met a few times back when I was doing the Primal Diet). AV's book is called "The Recipe for Living Without Disease." Challen's book is called "The Only Health Guide You Will Ever Need." Quite lofty claims!

    They both make very strange, random statements with very specific, contrived numbers.

    These are a few gems from Challen's book:

    "Brain tumors can form in 2-3 days."

    "You will only see a difference between fertile eggs and infertile eggs if you eat 2400 eggs everyday."

    "God lives in the Orion galaxy on a planet that has a diameter of 10,000,000 miles."

    "The liver produces 6,000,000,000 enzymes."

    "1 in 50,000,000 people have too long of a large intestine and need surgery."

    I'm a friend of the woman who introduced Matt to Challen, and I've known her since before she started RBTI. I have similar health issues as she had, so I'm willing to give it a try.

    If RBTI is for real, then it's definitely an amazing, unique, useful tool. But Challen should really hire an editor to re-write his books! :)

  25. John,
    Fructose also increases uncoupling proteins. Can you name the studies you are referring to?

    If fat oxidation increases the metabolic rate, why do most low-carbers tend to develop a rather slow metabolism with decreased calorie consumption? Dr. Lutz mentioned that most of his patients ate significantly less than people who ate carbohydrates. He also pointed out that his high fat diet reduced thyroid activity, which he believed to be beneficial.

  26. Matt,

    That's really discouraging about the books being unreliable or inconsistent with his actual practice. How is one supposed to learn the details of this method then? I can't quit my job and move my family to Wheeling just to study with Challan directly. Are you going to do you own thorough write-up (blog post or ebook) on this at some point?

    What about Book IV, "The Rules"? Are those at least accurate?

  27. Matt, are you coming to NYC?

    Please please come visit! We can go eat something ridiculous somewhere and I can tell you about how I recently lost 12 lbs. It's a secret hormonal trick I think you'll find interesting ;-)

  28. Flaunt.
    No take your test now. It is better to get a clearer picture when you haven't been following the program.

  29. Someone wrote:
    "But Challen should really hire an editor to re-write his books!"

    Enter Matt Stone. He's just the man for the job! And no doubt he will write more extensively about the subject the more he understands the RBTI… as well as his own ebooks… which I definitely look forward to : )

    Anyway, really interesting questions and commentary last few posts.

    Great stuff, Matt. Looking forward to more videos of Challen.

  30. Ok trying to add my two pence worth of ideas to the debate, without being too nitpicking…But I'm French it's not easy to stop nitpicking it's in my genes :-)

    Invisible Jungle I've got to say that such statements like :

    "God lives in the Orion galaxy on a planet that has a diameter of 10,000,000 miles."

    does make him look like he's a total wacko. Everyone knows God live in Heaven approximately 53 miles up the Grand Canyon btw.

    But otherwise…I will probably try Challen one day and see. So open minded. But I've got a very hard time to reconcile WAP findings, traditional diets and RBTI.

    For example pork as unclean meat…Chinese medicine recommend pork and pork fat and has been using it for millenia without developing the illnesses modern day society deal with. So maybe it only affect jews or muslins metabolisms then? lol

    Even more puzzling I was looking at Challen site yesterday and the story he told about his mentor warning about sourdough bread: very difficult to digest even for someone healthy and basically it will damage your health.

    Certainly not in line with WAP finding who in Switzerland found thriving communities eating mostly sourdough rye bread and raw cheese and having perfect teeth and heatlh, living outdoor etc?

    Moreover I don't understand the logic that says : eat things that are stripped of all their minerals (white flour, distilled water) and supplement and you'll be healthy; rather than going for mineralized food right away (sourdough bread, mineral water etc.).

    If this is a temporary measure to control the body chemistry as much as possible I understand; but if however this is life guidance forever I cannot work my mind around it, at all.

    So if RBTI is the greatest tool to recover health but once back on track you should eat a WAP inspired diet – including unclean meats etc. then I buy it. If this is a lifelong programm then I can't – how did humanity survive and developped less civilization disease for centuries while eating pork, drinking sourced water and sourdough bread then? This is to mee the biggest caveat.

    Or could it be that the level or exercise and lifestyle made all the difference – traditional people were living and working outdoor most of the year and therefore could eat "unclean" food and get away with the outburst of energy produced?

    • I totally agree with you. The guy sounds like a kook and I think is one. I got very sick a few years ago from being influenced by one of his disciples to drink distilled water. It leached the minerals right out of me and messed up my electrolites even with supplementation. And he.along with others take the dietary laws out of the bible totally out of context and wrongly interpret them to have been a health measure god commanded for the Jews to protect them from unhealthy meats, which is not true. The significance of it is spiritual only. It is symbolic of their sanctification as a people who must stay separate and set apart from the wickedness in the world. This can be deduced because the first time that man started eating meat was when god told Noah he could have every animal for food the same as the plants. This was spoken when Noah got off the ark. So god told Noah everything was good to eat. Then in the new testament things went back to this for Christians and in one of the peters, we read that every creature of god is good for food and nothing should be refused for food if it be sanctified with prayer. Also Mr waychoff is telling people to eat Margarine instead of butter, refined sugar and flour, and that sea salt is poison? My health has improved a lot from removing the processed foods and using sea salt. I had a friend whose edema went away upon using sea salt, and my dehydration with dry lips went away and electrolites imbalances when using the moist grey salt. I feel so much better. Not to mention people have been using it successfully for health and medicine for thousands of years. I’m sorry but I am more inclined to think that this system was received from a demon rather than god, and that some apparent successes from it are caused by the demon to trick people into getting into it. It is a complicated unintelligible system that will eat up all of your time or money or both to either get all the equipment and learn it or pay someone to do it for you. It will also cause you to become obsessed with it and food with all its strange restrictions and rules.

  31. Doug,
    I didn't need to come to the clinic in order to get better. I think you are referring to original RBTIer who give an interview with Matt.
    I was also pretty debilitated but managed to recover following the program at home
    p.s It is possible that I will come back over to Maui in the winter sometimes and could test you then but it's a long way off.

  32. Laurent,
    Reams said that if you had a strong mineral supply that you could eat anything. Problem is that most of us don't have a strong mineral supply because our soils are so depleted.
    Even eating organic doesn't mean that we are getting more minerals these days. So pork was what caused the greatest degree of energy loss, this was what he noticed when he tested thousands of people.

  33. Hi Pip

    I get what you are saying, at that would seem to confirm my views. However that's not exacly what Challen and Reams are saying on sourdough bread for exmample. Ream says that even if you are robust and healthy you would soon get weak and unhealthy eating the too difficult to digest sourdhough bread?!
    But then why maintaining this program for a lifetime once you have regain your health? Why not recommending people to go back to WAP diet that are much higher in mineral than modern depleted food? I get that you need a cast when your leg is broken but once it's healed you throw the cast away – using it would make you weaker and weaker.
    Same logic for milk. Challen emphasizes in this video the importance of vitamin A. I get that he recommends skim milk because the fat might be hard to digest; but we know (it's chemistry really) that consuming milk or any protein rich food without its fat will actually deplete the body from vitamin A – so not a great idea to get the body back on track is it? Better skip the milk until you can drink whole one don't you think?

    I think Reams and Challen system work as long as you don't put it in perspective with the WAP findings. Then it appears that there are some weird caveats that bother me. Once again I'd fine with it if Challen would say it's a temporary measure to control your body chemistry and go back on track. But that's not what he's saying – he basically recommend food to avoid etc. for your whole life.

  34. Pip here is the link

    and extract from Challen on sourdough bread.

    "One of the stories that Dr. Reams used in order to drive home a point of the RBTI is:

    No one should eat sourdough bread other than a logroller and if he eats sourdough bread very much he will not be able to roll logs very long!"

    The statement is clearly that a strong healthy man would see his health diminishing quickly if eating often sourdough bread. Compare this to the communities observed by WAP in Switzerland thriving on sourdough bread (even children and women).

    Challen is not talking about someone already sick here.

  35. Does anyone have Challen's contact details for me? I'd like to buy a testing kit.

  36. Laurent, Pip,
    If I may offer my thoughts.

    I believe what Laurent is saying is we can't ignore available evidence. I too have read Price's book. He observed that remote Swiss populations were very healthy subsisting largely on cheese and sourdough rye.

    I would think that RBTI practitioners such as Challen may be fairly adept at restoring body chemistry but it doesn't mean their way is the only way.

    The thing about traditional cultures such as the Swiss is they have a set of practices built by trial and error and observation over generations to maintain peak physical health.

    One of the things I've learned from "French Women Don't Get Fat" is that the French have somehow recreated this and adapted it to a modern world, so you could almost consider the French a "traditional" culture, but it didn't happen quickly. There was nothing like the French culture around food at the time of the Renaissance.

    There are no doubt multiple ways of maintaining excellent physical health. Contrast for example the RBTI recommendation to eat the large meal around noon vs. Chief's recommendation to eat mostly in the evening. RBTI is based on a lot of experimentation and results. Chief's recommendations are based on his observations of the elders in his traditional culture and what he's seen get results.

    It's very possible there are contexts where pork or sourdough or other foods do not lead to a loss of vitality that Challen is simply not aware of.

    Side note: on pork… I was wondering about the Okinawan diet so I looked up the Blue Zones info. Appears they eat it only infrequently. Hmm…
    Blue Zones Diet

    • I would question your facts. There are articles at the Weston Price website discussing the rampant misinformation about the diets of primitive, unindustrialized societies. For example all the info amongst primal/paleo people claiming that hunter gatherers ate low fat is total nonsense. There is an article called guts and grease that is about accounts from explorers and pioneers of what primitive natives were eating. The Okinawans ate quite a lot of pork and lard according to eyewitness accounts. The Indians were observed singling out older animals for their large amount of backfat. If times were plentiful they were known to take the fat and discard most of the carcass

  37. Aaron thanks for your great insight.
    I also believe there are contexts where forbidden food are not a problem at all. Maybe pork fat combined with rice all the time is marvellous – but pork with potatoes is a disaster?

    I am totally buying what Challen offers – but this approach of going for the most demineralized food and then supplement all the time doesn't scream freedom and traditional health to me.

    I would love for RBTI to confront their finding with WAP findings – and explain why in many populations the RBTI findings are contradicted by history. Because this is where it get very interesting – maybe there is a key element that bridge both and that we don't see (lifestyle – outdoors maybe?). Real life is not just made of pee testing and ph paper :-)

    Shame that Challen or Reams made such bold statements without studying other breakthrough work in nutrition – the views on sourdough bread for example doesn't buy a lot of credibility. But I'm already convinced anyway :-)

    • That sounds dumb. I mean to be convinced contrary to the evidence.

  38. I've been following the RBTI discussions with great interest. I'm a life long hypoglycemic (adrenal fatigue, severe anxiety, blackouts, palpitations, constipation since birth, and all the usual crud) and 44 years old now. Thanks to Matt and this info I now get why water and overexercising makes me so dang sick!

    For the past few weeks I've been eating fruit for breakfast and even had pancakes with maple syrup twice now (along with fruit). My pancake days were BY FAR the single best mood and energy days I've had in years. I'm on no supplements other than adding some liquid minerals to skim milk with meals. For now, I'm just doing the queen style breakfast, king style lunch, no sweets after 2pm and a salad for dinner. I have no problems avoiding the "no" foods. I never crave for anything. Pork, white potatoes and chocolate have always made me feel like crap.

    I haven't slept this good in years. My moods are so much better that I didn't even notice my period coming. I'm actually having regular movements everyday now, too.

    I will get tested when I am able to, as I would like to overcome the anxiety issues – but over time I know those will lessen more. The fact that I am actually making this post and not being my usual lurker-self is a sign of good things. BTW, today is a pancake day!! My thanks to Matt, Moi and Pip for sharing your knowledge and experiences!

    Michelle P.

  39. I also have been feeling amazing and today I felt like I knew I could if I get my chemistry right.Total new person with a warm feeling generating from my gut and endless energy.Was today the beginning of my new life or maybe a glimpse of what could be???Ohhhh I hope so!!!

    I am following Optimal diet though and take in large amounts of green veggies(2 boxes per meal)for my carbs(Kwasnieski recommends starch).Drinking milk instead of cream in coffee for the extra minerals etc.

    I am also looking into a top notch mineral supplement but I am still lost as to what Reams actually recommends or did.He mentioned there being 800(probably way off)calciums.Some alkalize while some acidify.This is where you can balance the body by using what you need.But I wanna be free of this so I will try to find what are the neutral calciums and take that only.

    And I did a semi lemon-water fast yesterday.I ate dinner at 12noon and then drank a gallon of distilled with one of those small plastic lemons squeezed in.I know this sounds crazy but I experienced the low blood sugar Reams was saying would happen.Just not strong though and in no way near what a good alcohol binge does to my sugar regulation.:(

    But today,as I mentioned earlier,I just woke up and felt different.Gonna drink this gallon of distilled and a lemon ball per day to see what it brings me.I know its not RBTI but Reams does mention things like this being adequate for health.Tons of variety in foods to fill the calcium storage of the body but in todays world its hard to do with the produce we get being low nutrient.Lots of greens for chlorophyll and minerals.Small amount of meat.I know he was low fat and maybe if my hypoglycemia goes away I will try his diet…but I do love Optimal meals.

  40. Michelle!
    Thanks for Posting that! I have all the same problems that you do but have only had it a year and it's making me miserable and crazy.
    I can't imagine having it for life.
    I really appreciate anyone who can attest to coming back from all that.
    I have been collecting success stories re RBTI and adrenal fatigue as I wait for my test kit to arrive:)
    I too have been slowly, a little at a time, implementing all that basic hypoglycemic eating rules, for the past 2 – 3 weeks and notice a big difference already myself!
    Can't believe I had 4 different medical professionals telling me to drink lots and lots of water and to cut out all carbs! It's almost like they were trying to do me in! Lol. Good luck to everyone out there and yes a resounding THANKYOU to Matt, Moi, Pippa, and Challen!

  41. I have to second (third?) the idea that Challen needs an editor. And I mean, BADLY.

    It's poorly organized, you never know what to expect or what the topic is, typos abound and I could not get past the crazy, CRAZY sounding statements that were randomly sprinkled throughout the book.

    That being said, I kept rooting for him and thinking that he had something to say, only didn't say it in a way that helped his case. Hopefully Matt can come to the rescue!

    I had my consultation with Challen this week and he described both me and my husband perfectly. With me, he was stumped for a few minutes, saying that he couldn't "see the big picture" because something was distorting it. He asked me whether I was taking blood-sugar medication (no), or herbs (no) and I thought I had him. He said we'd come back to it, and as he was talking he said, "Oh I KNOW! Are you eating a good amount of sea salt?" Drat. Yes, I was. My adrenals are so low that I was actually eating it out of my palm sometimes.

    He also described me as hypoglycemic and how I felt because of it (yes), anemic, low on potassium and manganese, and, among some other things, that I might already be developing vericose veins (weird, but yes!).

    So after that, I'm eager to hear him out, try his theory and feel better soon!

    And by the way, he told me to do basically the general protocol: avoid no foods, eat on a schedule with largest meal at noon, drink the sweetened lemonade on a schedule, take supplements he's sending me, and eat more of certain foods (for me: soft seeded veggies like okra, cucumber, squash and zuchini; bananas, hominy, salmon).

    He said taking out the sea salt would help me and my constipated-with-eczema baby in a matter of days. That's easy to test!

    I haven't had a crash at all following Matt/Challen's hypoglycemic advice in the last few weeks, so it was easy to decide to do what Challen has suggested now.

  42. Does anyone else see RBTI practitioner/consultant in Matt's future? :)

  43. Awesome Kelly! Thanks for the update! Will look forward to hearing more!

  44. @Wolfstriked

    Calcium gluconate has a neutral effect on the body. Gluconate is going to always be one of the foundational calciums/minerals that needs to be provided. In RBTI Calcium Citrate is also seen as neutral. Some claim calcium citrate has a slightly alkaline effect.

  45. Living in Pittsburgh, this makes me want to take a trip to Wheeling!

  46. what does rbti say about eggshell for calcium. its apparently as bioavailable as dairy. and calcium from eggshell/food increases fat oxidation but from supps does not.

  47. Kelly, wow!

    Guess I'll not worry so much about sea salt now – I'm a salt licker too!

    A lot of the foods he recommended for you (guessing it may be similar for me) would be nigh impossible or very expensive to get here. Hope he's familiar with Hawaiian foods!

    I'm curious about the sourdough too. I think Matt explained the apparent contradiction with WAP in that it's because neither we nor our immediate ancestors grew up eating that way – so our bodies are actually poorly adapted to eat a traditional diet and cannot get healthy on one. At least, I think that's what it was.

    Besides, as I've pointed out before, not a one of us (in America at least) are really going to eat a truly traditional diet. We're not going to eat mostly only sourdough rye and cheese and play in mountain streams because we're not there. We pick and choose which part of each traditional diet we want, and maybe it can't work that way. Maybe you have to have that climate and that environment and follow the entire local diet.

    After all, as Matt keeps pointing out, these WAPF promoters are all having issues too, even the ones who've done it for years. They may be healthier than they would have been otherwise, but they're not necessarily truly healthy. Maybe they could never be, or maybe WAPF is good, but not good enough.

    And so RBTI is another tool to get there. Curious too though if Matt is feeling that the diet recommendations are good lifestyle changes, or merely a temporary thing (whether a few months or a few years) until you heal.

    Pippa, did you move?

  48. Sarah,

    I have to be real strict about the meal timing so far. I no longer wait for my husband to get home from work or to be hungry enough to eat when *I need* to eat. I'm an early riser and my mood declines quite fast, so breakfast is around 6am. I'm making lunch at some point after 11am because I need to be eating no later than noon – not just starting to prepare it. Same with dinner. I need to eat right about 5:00 or my mood drops.

    Also, I haven't taken my morning temperature yet, but I cannot wear a bathrobe in the morning any longer. I start to sweat and it used to take about 30 minutes of intense cardio before I would even begin to perspire a little. I've always been a major freezy cat!


    Adding lots of mixed salad greens has helped me big time. Especially in the regularity department. I make up a batch of 2-3 days worth of chopped veggies (different all the time) and buy the pre-cut salad blends to keep things simple and quick. I love not having to cook at night!

    Michelle P.

  49. Thank you peeps.I am reading the PH miracle right now and remembered I had PH strips.I went and tested my urine and I am at 5.5.This is what I was many many yrs ago and the doctor told me that it is not important at that time.More sad facts and I hope I am not too late.I have lumps all over my stomach……doctor found the 3 big ones when he rubbed my stomach on my last ER visit and said I probably have alot more….but never mentioned it again.:(

    BIG ONE…I get physically sick whenever I eat food and then I feel good again.I have trouble breathing and cant climb the stairs when I get out the train every morning…..and this is 40minutes after I eat.But then I feel great and work like an animal.Then I crash again and feel lousy as hell after meal two.

    WTF my whole life has been this way and I hope I finally find a cure.Could be that my kindey disorder is causing the acidosis since KD is known to do that.

    I'm sad,scared and mad all at once right now but "hope" I am onto something that will finally cure the ill feelings I have had my whole life.Today was enlightening. :)

  50. Why do I feel sick as a dog after a meal??? I think its due to my blood acidifying from the incoming foods.But that doesn't explain my never having a cavity or my skin that doctors have a hard time getting stitch needle thru.

  51. I also would like to report very positive reactions to eliminating the "no no foods" (in my case it was just replacing my white rice with brown rice and butter with extra virgin olive oil) and drinking lemonade. I've changed nothing else. i still drink alcohol 2-3x a week. So far I've seen drastic improvements to my ability to sleep at a consistent time (hell, the ability to sleep at all prior to dawn), a steady increase in my ability to be creative and in general be the "fun" person I, by nature, am. It feels sustainable, too, not that i-just-went-zero-carb-and-feel-FANTASTIC feeling. i'm definitely losing fat while maintaining muscle mass (i actually think i'm gaining, but it's too early to tell. i just have the same physical feelings i had when i started sleeping whenever and i gained a bunch of lean body mass as well as fat).

    interestingly, i had been slowly gaining weight while eating predominantly buttered white rice, ground beef, and fruit juice (i always eat whichever macronutrient i'm in the mood for). now it's extra virgin olive oil'd brown rice and ground beef with fruit juice. i've also been losing my craving for fatty foods. in general, i'd say this is the most relaxed i've been in a whiiiiiiiiiiiile.

    i've also seem temperature improvements. my morning temp dropped a few months ago to the low 97s from the low 98s. my anxiety was starting to come back and my sleep quality was worsening. i didn't think of it until recently, but it was around the time i started eating more white rice. now it's fairly solidly in the 98 range.


  52. @The Real Will

    i used to live in Pittsburgh 2-3 years ago. Decent town. Now I live in Akron, Ohio. SIXBURGH!


  53. Saliva PH is off the chart of PH test strips I have being 8.Man I am way off the RBTI scale LOL!

  54. OMG just tested nyc tap water and it is 5.5……all these yrs I thought that the tap water was hard becuase a fishtank specialist told me that.Just realized that I have no calcium deposits anywhere on my sinks.First thing I am doing is gonna start drinking pure distilled as that is supposedlly ph=7.

  55. Lorelei,

    WAPF isn't good enough for me. I have been into WAPF for 12 years and can't attribute any health benefits to it at all. I certainly became more neurotic about food for sure.

    At 5'7" and 125lbs I've been told I am healthy, so the reason I feel like crap must all be in my head. About 10 years ago I went to a very popular Dr. M. and, even though my workups showed a sluggish liver and thyroid, I was asked point blank "so why are you even here?". This was because I seemed to be eating a great diet, exercising a lot and *looked* healthy. A few years later I went back and was diagnosed with adrenal fatigue and provided with some supplements.

    Now, several more years later, I am unable to deal with even the slightest amount of stress. I gave up on doctors a long time ago and have been trying to figure this out on my own. No supplements, pastured meats, raw milks, etc., have done anything to help me feel good. Consider me a former WAPFer now. I'll still eat healthy foods, but I'm not going to worry about all that WAPF stuff.

  56. I like the idea of eating like a queen, king and pauper and am just starting this today. i always crave sweet foods in the evening so it will be interesting to see what happens when i have a very large lunch including sweet foods. i hope i lose my cravings for sweets in the evening!

    i am wondering about PH levels. i have never studied any PH diets but have started to test my PH throughout the day. i am wondering why Challen only recommends testing PH one time per day. from what i can see so far, my PH levels are very erratic! also, as i had mentioned earlier i am working w/ a local practitioner who suggests testing my morning urine only. challen recommends 10-11am from what i understand. my morning PH is the most consistent of all. always very very low!

    thanks, Matt and Pippa for introducing us to this diet. i think there our definitely some takeaways here! hard to wrap my WAPF brain around them, but i am open! the only reason i am not ordering a kit is because we just raised pigs for the first time ever and they are going to the butcher tomorrow! :( we have no major health issues over here so i think i will wait a bit so that we can enjoy that bacon!

  57. Pippa,

    I believe I talked with you on the
    phone today.

    You were helping me understand the "rules of the sugar"

    You were explaining about drinking water. My sugar has been so low.
    I was told not to drink any water.

    However, my sugar has maintained all day at about 1.9.
    So I was happy, feel much better!
    Now, my sugar is 2.5, and I haven't had dinner. What to do?

    I tried to call Challen but, he is already gone for the day.

    Please help.



  58. Matt,first off I just wanna say I love you Bro!!! I think this RBTI is my ticket to a start of a healthy life.What Challen says in the video enlightened me to distilled water and that my heavy consumption,in the gallons of NYC tap water per day,may be steering me towards death by cancer.

    Challen said….

    "ANOTHER RULE is the PH of the urine will gravitate towards the PH of the water your drinking if you drink it systematically.NOTHING,NOTHING,NOTHING repairs the body like pure clean distilled water.Anybody gets sick,the best thing they can do is drink distilled water systematically.It will pull dead cells out from clear the tip of the fingers to the tips of the toes out of your system.Now you can drink too much of it and there is certain rules you must follow for the sugar and things BUT it works."

  59. Sorry for so many posts.Forgot to add that my tap water PH is 5.5 matching perfectly my urine PH at 5.5

  60. The only thing I am really having a hard time with is the recommended fats (olive oil and corn oil versus butter, coconut oil). What is the reasoning for not eating butter? And, could there be a difference between raw butter and pasturized butter (somehow I have been brainwashed by WAPF) with RBTI? I remember Challen telling Moi that her olive oil was rancid- and it fixed the problem for her. Could a change in butter i.e. going from store pasturized butter to raw or freshly made butter make a difference in the numbers?

  61. Has anyone heard from Trix? Her last comment was something about not feeling well. :-/

  62. I was hoping to hear more from Trix and others who have recently started RBTI too.

  63. I'm checking in after about 7 days on the starch/veggie/meat/low-fat/no-dairy diet.

    My digestion hasn't improved any and I can't seem to get my body temperature above the mid 96s, probably because I'm only absorbing a small amount of the food I eat. My lymph system is less clogged than on the previous high-fat/high-starch HED, but other than that all my candida and digestive issues are still pretty bad. I've stayed away from fruits except for a few strawberries and lemons since I can't seem to eat fructose without gas and diarrhea. I've gained a few pounds since starting RRARF 19 days ago, but I was pretty skinny to begin with so no problem there.

    For now, I'm going to try a diet with no-fiber, a little starch like white rice, fat, meat and maybe some cultured dairy.

    I'm keeping an eye on the RBTI stuff. For what it's worth, yesterday my urine pH was about 6.5 and saliva was ~6.8. On my previous low-carb affair, by saliva pH was >7.2 and urine was low 5s. I didn't experience any increase in health as my numbers moved closer to the ideal, just the opposite. Of course, that's only two numbers.

    It's interesting to hear that people have experienced dental regeneration with Challen. I've always tried to keep my salivia pH above 7.2 since I believed a high pH was necessary to allow for remineralization of the enamel.

    For a someone who's 23 and has been living a "healthy lifestyle" for years, I don't seem to be doing very well. Working on it…

  64. I love you guys for sharing your experiences with this and how specifically it is helping you! I am beginning to believe more and more that I have had hypoglycemia for a very long time. I keep getting to a place after changing my diet or taking new supplements where I feel somewhat cured, but last night confirmed that I am surely not. I had an episode that I actually have not had in a long time and it kind of freaked me out. I get to a point where I just cannot decide on what to eat and nothing sounds good so I just don't eat anything. Then I start obsessing because I know if I don't eat then I will feel like crap, but I already feel so bad and my kids begin to make the stress worse and then I feel trapped, like I can't do anything. I become extremely emotional at both extremes and I cannot shut my brain off. Then of course my stomach growls all night long making it impossible to sleep well and all I can do is think about food, but of course all the "rules" i have in my head make it impossible for me to just get up and eat something.

    I am probably making the mistakes of not eating right when I wake in the morning, but instead usually almost 2 hours later. And then I rarely eat very much for lunch because I literally cannot think of anything to make that would truly fill me up so I end up snacking at best. Then waiting until husband gets home to even start dinner and it ends up taking so long to cook that we don't eat until around 6:30 or 7. And then I eat ice cream or some sweets before bed. I also don't drink much water because it either gives me heartburn or makes me nauseous if I have no food in my stomach.

    So a couple of questions for those of you who are benefitting from a "hypoglycemia" diet:

    *without having my numbers (I don't have a way to test yet) would Challen be able to help me by just listening to me describe my situation?
    *do you think it's important to eat something different every day at every meal or does that matter?

    Thanks for any help!

  65. Michelle,

    I'm glad you're feeling better on this type of diet. My story (and Lorelei's!) sounds similar to yours.

    Your comment about meal-timing is interesting! I think maybe I should pay more attention as well. I'm glad you shared!

  66. Matt,

    Thank you for this series of fascinating and hilarious posts.

    Do you have any feel for what might be recommended to someone like myself who struggles to gain weight (from underweight) even doing HED?

    It took me 6 or 7 months to go from the low 160s up to a well-muscled 175 lbs in May (I'm 6'3" tall) and then the stress of a relationship break-up knocked all of that off of me in 2 weeks flat. 3 months later and I'm still stuck in the low 160s even eating like 6 large potatoes, a pound of beans, one or two cups of whole milk, several tablespoons of added fat, a bunch of veggies, and small amounts of meat or eggs at every meal, with fruit in between. I'm eating two meals a day because they take me almost an hour to eat, but I'm still hungry after and can easily drop a pound or two in one day just by eating a big dinner instead of a massive dinner. Not good. Constipation, congestion, skin fungus, and non-existent libido still continue to be problems.

    Any insights?

    Thanks, Matt.

  67. Wolfstriked,

    Be careful with the distilled water and lemon. Sounds like you have some serious stuff going on. I'll only do that if I'm told to do so based on my numbers. I'm too hesitant to try that on my own.


    Thanks and I hope some better meal timing helps you, too!

    Michelle P.

  68. Thanks Michelle,I will keep with it because I think that I am healthy enough to not die from it :)I am reading all over the net on RBTI like crazy.Seems I am very deficient in calcium buffers and that is why my body is excreting as much acid as it can.Like chalen said the PH of the urine will gravitate to the PH of the water if you drink it sytematically.Water for me is a system I live by and so that will at least bring the urine PH to close to 7.The saliva of PH seems to be an indicator of liver health and my high PH explains why I get indigestion for hours on end after each meal.Confusing stuff but I think I have a plan.Gonna try the distilled lemon water for a week and then see what type of calcium to supplement with tto get into the good range.I hope to finally see that health feeling I yearn for but only see glimpses of here and there.

  69. Dudes!!!

    I just read all of your comments. So busy right now. But so fun too. It's like a frenzy right now all this stuff.


    Overheard that conversation the other day. Didn't realize that was you! Ha, he totally busted you on that sea salt!

    He busted this other chick in the office today on eating meat at night. She was trying to hide it, but finally had to give in. Chicken McNugget run last night. So funny.


    Totally visiting you in Pittsburgh. Getting my car worked on up there next Friday. Come rescue me at the Mini dealership at 9:30am and we can go hang out. Let me know if you want me to bring a test kit. I'd love to test you and your wife and kid. Guarantee you'd see some massive improvements.

  70. BETTY

    If you are close to dinner time that's fine. No need to drink anything. Once you have finished your drinks at 3pm for the day. That's it no need to drink anymore. 2.5 is fine. Your sugar will come up later in the day. If it drops back below a 1.5 then take a bite of fruit.
    Hope that helps.
    Good speaking with you

  71. Matt, come back and re-read our comments and share your wisdom! And please make your way to the west coast. :)

  72. deedle-

    maybe its because butter/coconut oil are so saturated and for whatever reason its too much. if you don't eat fat your body will make around equal saturated/monounsaturated fats from carbs.

  73. terpol,

    You can make monounsaturates from saturated fats (maybe not short chain).

  74. either way maybe there is benefit for some to eat more monounsaturated than saturated fat.

    any link on converting saturates to unsaturates?

  75. Matt, was that Friday the 26th?

    Are you going to the Mini on Baum?

    Let me know.

  76. @Anonymous Ex-Pittsburgher…

    Should be Sevenburgh…damn Stillers! :-)


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