Recently I posted a letter written by nutrition researcher David Brown to his local newspaper. The topic was reducing the total quantity of omega 6 polyunsaturated fat in the diet to reduce tissue and blood concentration of this type of fatty acid ? which has a lot of negative associations, such as triggering excess inflammation and other key properties.
Although I think as long as vegetable oil is out of the diet almost 100%, this is not something to really get your panties in a wad about. But there is certainly some indication that our tissue concentration of omega 6 is so high that it might be worth the effort to be extremely diligent about avoiding omega 6 from all sources to undo this imbalance.
To do that most effectively, which is probably even more important on a high-fat diet as we take in a large quantity of all fats ? and therefore deserve to give the issue heightened vigilance, is to construct the diet based primarily on the following foods:
Red meat
Coconut, including coconut milk and oil
Fish
Dairy products
Root vegetables
Rice
Non-starchy vegetables
Macadamia nuts, including macadamia nut oil
Red meat comes from ruminant animals like cows and lamb. Ruminant animals convert omega-6-rich corn and grain (and of course grass) mostly to monounsaturated and saturated fat. Unlike pigs, poultry, and humans, no matter how much polyunsaturated fat they receive in their diet, their body fat will never be comprised of more than 4% polyunsaturated fat (from what I understand). Grassfed or not, red meat simply isn’t a rich source of omega 6 in either case compared to other foods. As far as meats go, it’s the runaway top choice.
Pork is considerably higher in PUFA, but not nearly as high in PUFA as poultry of any kind. If you do eat poultry, it’s probably wiser, if you are attempting to decrease your tissue concentration of omega 6 (this can be tested nowadays too, probably a very important tool that we’ll get into using in the future of 180), to eat your poultry without the skin. This will also keep you from eating too much poultry, cuz poultry without the skin kinda sucks :)
All nuts, seeds, and nut and seed oils should be avoided completely, including peanuts (especially so), except for one exception ? Macadamia nuts. Once again, I’m not trying to create a paranoia. I eat a cup or so of nuts every week, plenty of pork, and I put peanuts in my Massaman curry. I’m just reporting on what is highest in omega 6 if you decide to see-for-yourself what power lies in reducing your tissue concentration of omega 6.
I don’t know about you, but I find it to be damn good news that Macadamia nuts are lowest in omega 6. Talk about the king of all nuts. Why bother eating any other kind of nut anyway? I would recommend getting very fresh macadamias, such as that sold by Pangaia, if you really want to mow down lots of these badboys. Of course, make sure you’re macadamias are not roasted in vegetable oil, as they commonly are.
Corn and wheat tend to have the highest levels of omega 6 of the starchy foods, but the amount of overall fat is fairly insignificant compared to what you get from vegetable oil, nuts, seeds, pork, and poultry. Do ya sweat it? I don’t think so. Keep eating your spoonbread girls.
On the omega-3 side of things, it’s doubtful, with omega 6 restriction, that you’d need to take any kind of omega 3 supplement. If you do take one, it seems most prudent to me to take a large dose for about a month (5 grams) and then taper off or eliminate the supplement altogether. I do recommend eating a portion or two of wild-caught salmon every week for both the tiny amount of omega 3 that we need, as well as pre-formed Vitamin D, B-12, and selenium. Wild-caught salmon is one of the richest sources of all of those key nutrients.
As far as cooking fat is concerned, the ONLY low omega-6 options are:
Coconut oil (refined/expeller-pressed is tasteless and odorless and has the same benefits)
Butter or ghee
Beef tallow
Macadamia nut oil
The “oil change” is the most significant change you can make in terms of limiting and replacing omega 6.
Oh yeah, and if you absolutely must have mayo, make your own from extra light olive oil, but don’t eat too much of it. A better option, as was discussed in the comments section of David Brown’s Omega 6 post, was to make a spread out of sour cream to subsitute for mayo. That’s a much better solution if ya axe me.
The top 10 best foods you can possibly consume for INCREASING your omega 6 tissue concentration are:
Commercial peanut butter
Common oil-roasted snack nuts
French fries
Other Fried foods at restaurants
Salad dressings, including most vinaigrettes and Caesar dressing as well as Cole Slaw
Commercial Mayo and mayo-based sauces like aioli and remoulade
Doughnuts
High-fat sweets like Hostess Twinkies, Oreos, etc.
Margarine and foods often made with margarine like cookies and brownies
Vegetable oil, especially corn oil
Shortening and foods with shortening, such as most biscuits and pie crusts
If there were a "like" button, I'd push it.
I've noticed I need more omega-3 lately to keep inflammatory stuff at bay. May be because I'm still breastfeeding and had run out of stored omega-3 (it gets siphoned off for your progeny, from what I understand). But it may be because I've started eating more chicken and bacon. I'd thought it might be because the local dairy stuff I buy is not grass-fed in the winter.
I get a bit tired of beef, though, and don't like pork or lamb. What's a girl to do? Anyway, useful info. Keep putting it out there. Most people, even health-conscious types, have no idea omega-6 is a problem.
BTW, last summer I was unable to get a sunburn, which hadn't been possible since I was a kid. It was the first summer I'd eliminated omega-6s, but I didn't make the connection until I read others reporting the same thing. My allergies were also only about 15% of their usual badness.
Thanks Helen. It's true that mother's milk contains perhaps more long chain omega 3's than that of any other mammal. This should be looked at as a great chunk of logic for the tiny handful of omega 3 bashers out there.
Just ate a chicken drumstick with the skin on. Bummer! It's just so goddamn delicious! But on the other hand I just got a huge package of grass-fed beef today, yay!
Coconut oil and butter are all the fats anyone needs anyways.
What about flax oil? Can you make mayonnaise from flax oil?
Also why does noone ever mention palm oil? It is about half saturated fat and most of the rest is the omega-9 acid, oleic acid.
Fatty acid content of palm oil
Type of fatty acid pct
Palmitic C16 44.3%
Stearic C18 4.6%
Myristic C14 1.0%
Oleic C18 38.7%
Linoleic C18 10.5%
Other/Unknown 0.9%
Palm Kernel oil is even better. Way more than half saturated fat (82%) and almost no linoleic acid (just 2.3%):
Fatty acid content of palm kernel oil
Type of fatty acid pct
Lauric C12 48.2%
Myristic C14 16.2%
Palmitic C16 8.4%
Capric C10 3.4%
Caprylic C8 3.3%
Stearic C18 2.5%
Oleic C18 15.3%
Linoleic C18 2.3%
Other/Unknown 0.4%
"You girls keep eatin' your spoonbread."
I literally "booya'd" outloud when I read that. Up top spoonbread girls.
Helen wrote:
"If there were a "like" button, I'd push it."
Word, Helen!
Palm Oil and palm kernal oil have been popping up in ingredients lists. Maybe people are finally starting to see the light in the stupid damning of tropical oils to "bad fat" list. Unfortunately they've been in those "and/or" products. I have a rule that if I see and/or in an ingredient list I automatically put it back. If the company doesn't even know what's in it for sure then I want no part of it.
I haven't seen palm kernal oil at my co-op yet. Does it tend to be expensive? I ask because I've been lobbying my favorite local restaurant to switch from soybean oil to something better. Coconut oil is a hard sell because its expensive and can turn solid below 70 degrees (not that's much of a problem in most commercial kitchens).
I just looked around for palm kernel oil on the web. I only found it from vendors selling to soapmakers. It is used in confections but I couldn't find edible palm kernel oil for sale anywhere. Palm oil you can buy at Whole Foods. Its in a plastic blue tub and its labeled 'Vegetable Shortening'. They also sell unprocessed palm oil in a jar. That's got a taste that you may or may not like. Palm Kernel oil is 82% saturated so it will be solid at room temp. Palm oil is also solid at room temp but its softer, I'm sure that's because its only about 50% saturated. As for avoiding omega 6 though palm oil is 10% linoleic acid which is an omega 6. Palm Kernel Oil is 2.3% linoleic, about like coconut oil.
In my experience Palm Oil is pretty much the same price class as coconut oil.
According to something I read on the web:
http://www.drweil.com/drw/u/id/QAA118473
Spectrum oils doesn't do a palm kernel oil because it can only be extracted using harsh chemicals. That may be why you are only seeing it being sold to soap makers. Guess if you could figure out how to extract that palm kernel oil with an expeller you'd be rich.
I noticed while looking on Spectrum's website, that their vegetable shortening is 100% expeller pressed palm oil. It's obviously highly saturated.
Hey while on the topic of fats: has anybody tried to make a piecrust with coconut oil. Being in Minnesota, my coconut oil is always "vegetable shortening" unless I melt it in a pan.
Great article! Always nice when someone reinforces that you're doing everything right.
I've pretty much dropped my consumption of nuts, but didn't realize macadamia was one of the nut good guys. I thought walnut had that title.
So what about expeller pressed sunflower oil? It is almost identical to olive oil in composition.
I once bought palm oil (it's orange,) but just could not stomach it. The flavor was way too strong, like grassy or like hay, and I just didn't like it.
Ok, you guys need to look at mountainroseherbs.com. This website is awesome.
unrefined coconut oil is 37.$ a gallon, refined is 21.$ a gallon, macadamia oil is 10.75$ for 16oz and 71.$ for 1 gallon, they also have palm oil and palm kernel oil at 23.$ a gallon, it says expeller/refined, not too sure what that means. It is all organic too. This site has like every single oil there is.
There are many good homemade mayo recipes out there that usually use about equal amounts coconut oil and olive oil.
Matt, if homemade why did you say not to eat much mayo. All it is is the oil you use to make it, egg, and lemon juice really. I dont see anything there being a problem unless you dont like olive oil. Olive oil is a little higher in PUFA than the others you recommend but otherwise its not bad at all (though according to Dr.Wong {www.drwong.us} most olive oil you buy at the store will be a mix of olive oil and deodorized soy bean oil with added olive fragrance. He says to test if olive oil is real and good to put it in the fridge overnight and it the middle of it solidifies some (SOME, mind you) then it is real. He suggests Braggs Olive Oil. I have not tested or researched any of what he said on the subject, I am just relaying info)
Is that perhaps why?
Everyone interested, just do a search for coconut oil mayo recipes on google.
On Omega 3s: Awhile back with the AV Skeptics group and Bruce, we also frequented the Scientific Debate Forum. He had a lot about Omega 3s there, and his opinion (which seemed to make sense based on the evidence Ive seen) is that Omegas 3s stop the metabolization by cells of the arachadonic acid from Omega 6s, thus reducing the inflammation caused by the Omega 6s, which is why so many get reductions in their inflammation by taking Omega 3 oils. The problem with this, he says, is that the Omega 3s do a lot more damage over time with oxidation and free radicals that it's way worse in the long run to use Omega 3s to stop the Omega 6s (assuming you are taking the Omega 3 oils for long periods of time). I remember one study done feeding mice their fat as omega 3s vs omega 6s, and the omega 6 mice lived longer but died of tumors and such but the omega 3 mice lived about 20% less time and died of weird causes (cant remember what they were now). I dont remember much else about the study. Again, me just relaying information.
Thanks for the tip vida, I will check it out.
I think this post came along at a great time. I've been noticing everything at my co-op lately is "omega -3" this and that. Even my beloved macaroons (Jennie)which I adore because they are so refreshingly free of rubish ingredients and marketing have come up with an Omega-3 version that is displacing other stuff from the shelves. Omega-3 is the new soy. Gah. Every diet guru is pushing their own special formula. Flax oil salesmen=snake oil salesman. I just flat out don't trust somebody that's pushing supplements.
About cod liver oil and other fish oils: "It is important that I emphasize here some dangers that are not usually recognized or properly emphasized in the literature. When fish oils including cod liver oils are given in too large doses to some patients they experience quite definite symptoms of depression. The available evidence indicates that fish oils that have been exposed to the air may develop toxic substances. My work and that of others with experimental animals has demonstrated that paralysis can be produced readily by over-dosing. Serious structural damage can be done to hearts and kidneys. I have reported this in considerable detail." Guess who? W.P. man himself, page 267, 8TH edition.
Funnily, high EPA fish oil is being used succesfully as a theraphy for bipolar disorders and the like. It is a complicated subject. In one hand, you can say it has a theoretical therapeutic effect, like lithium. Lithium supresses the thyroid, so can fish oil, but of course this may be just a coincidence (in what respects to this topic), and the doses never go above a few grams. There may not be any relationship, just guessing. On the other hand, it may be a bypassing of metabolic problems and provide enough of a needed nutrient for a body that can't produce it, not because of insufficient omega 3, but too much omega 6, which interrupts conversion of parent omega 3 to derivatives. Then, reducing omega 6 would look much more promising.
BTW, I'ven't been following temps, but iodine megadosing has made me feel warmer (or less cold). Also revived some of my long forgotten acne, but I hope the milk diet takes care of that. And b12 (methylcobalamin) is the shit.
Good commentary. Looks like we're all pretty much on the same page.
Drew-
Olive oil is fine, but the couple grams of PUFA per T adds up really quick in something as concentrated as mayo. That's why, for the super anal trying to really launch an effort at reducing omega 6, mayo is definitely not the best choice.
Palm oil… yuck.
Mayo with flax oil… double yuck.
El66k-
Great WP citation. Exciting news with the iodine.
Grok Star-
A lot of health gurus get mad boners over walnuts because they have a lot of omega 3. They have WAY more omega 6 than 3. Macadamia nuts are unique b/c they have a whole lot of neither.
Vida-
Thanks for the link. Sunflower oil is not too bad actually. A little unfair to lump it in with all the other seed oils.
Thanks for the oil data TMS.
And Jenny. Preach on. Omega 3 is the new soy. Sure, it may be beneficial to someone eating a lot of omega 6, but a much better alternative is to cut out the omega 6 and hardly give omega 3 a second thought.
Alright, that's it! I'm gonna screw the cod liver oil. Wasn't the highest quality anyways and if it even might be capable of surpressing the thyroid, well than I really don't see much of a benefit in it. I'm just gonna try to reduce Omega 6 like most of you seem to do. And I'm gonna go very very light on nuts. Had quite some nuts the last weeks and my teeth did really not like that anyways.
Thanks, Matt. You managed to pull yet another 180 on a health topic where I thought I was on the right side.
So do you guys have any recommendations on iodine supps?
Iodoral is s'posed to be the shizzy nizzy.
http://www.amazon.com/Iodoral-12-5-Mg-180-Tablets/dp/B000X843VG/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=hpc&qid=1264664562&sr=8-1
Gonna try it myself in the next month or so.
milk diet is the real shizzle nizzlez for iodine
@EL66K: What exactly do you mean with megadosing? How much gram do you take? And are you male or female?
@Jedi: Yeah, Iodoral seems to be pretty much the best supp. It's Lugol's solution in tablet form. Unfortunately I can't get it, because I've only found US sources of it and shipping supplements from the US to Europe usually means trouble.
That's why I'm taking Lugol's solution. After doing the patch test, which came out positive, making it more likely that I am iodine deficient. I started with one drop this morning. Just took it. So far I'm noticing a slightly increased heart rate, but that's it. But of course you can't expect to immediately feel a dramatic effect.
As a newbie, this is all a bit advanced for me, but I get the picture on Omega 6 reduction…although I do think it will be hard to avoid meats other than beef. I've only just come back from a semi-veggie diet to eating meat in the last couple of months since my discovery of 180, and have been enjoying the lot so that's a bit of a bummer.
I spoke to Matt about the coconut oil thing and realised I'd bought the unrefined stuff and couldn't stomach it…so I don't use it much at all..if I can 'lose' it in curry or something, I do. I'll source some of the odourless, tasteless variety when I'm ready to spend another big chunk on fat! Otherwise, I've been enjoying using lots of butter but also duck and goose fat, some lard and some olive oil. I'm thinking now I'm gonna be told there's a high concentration of Omega 6 in duck and goose fats and leave them out???
Also, nuts…god, they've been my little filler, my evening snack…a mix of walnuts, brazils,almonds, hazlenuts, cashews and some macadamia…not in vast quantities but maybe a few every day. So, best to stick to macadamia I'm now hearing – another bummer.
And an unrelated query here… I've picked up from the discussions that tracking morning temperatures is something many of you have done as it's an indicator of metabolic function, am I right? So, I decided, after two months on 180, pretty much high-everything (after starting a-la-Schwarzbein on pretty low carbs but getting heartburn and adjusting it up a little to good effect), I'd start to do this temps checking. My first reading was this morning.. 95.4 Now you're gonna tell me this makes me like the walking dead, right?
Is there anything else I need to know…and bear in mind, I'm serious about healing my metabolism after nearly 30 years of low-fat and NO sat fats adherence/dieting/massive weight fluctuations/excessive exercising -and I'm allowing it all to come to pass in its rightful time. I'm not impatient, just want to be on the right track in every department if I can. I do need to lose body fat but not caring how long it takes if I'm becoming healthy first.
Btw, The change in diet has improved my sleep, taken away my sugar cravings (halle-bloody-luia!!!!)evened out my moods and improved my motivation levels, so I've started exercising again too!!
Cheers! Irene
My 1st post here. I love this site, with it's open-minded search for healing diets. I have a very weird, crippling condition and have been investigating every healing diet I find. Has anyone here looked at the work of Brian Peskin? His views on omega 6 and 3 are somewhat contrarion. His website is brianpeskin.com and some of his lectures are online on video. There's also a recent podcast interview with him by Patrick Timpone at oneradionetwork. Timpone has a lot of interesting health and diet interviews from many points of view. I'd love to hear Matt interviewd by him. Doug N
Btw, what the heck is 'spoonbread'???? Puzzled Brit here.
Irene, you can write well for a dead person! Jus' kiddin.'
Spoonbread is a cornmeal mush mixed with eggs and baked. It's kind of like a cornmeal-based savory bread pudding.
Sounds like you're getting some of the perks of HED now. I got mad heartburn on Schwarzbein too, until I upped the carbs. I kind of suspect that Schwarzbein, if anything, is on the wrong end of "being in the middle" when it comes to carbs.
Please don't sweat this post too much. But you will probably be better off using lard, beef tallow, coconut oil, and butter/ghee for cooking as opposed to poultry fat. Poultry fat for cooking is almost like using Canola oil when it comes to omega 6. As for eating meats, eat a variety. I do. I'm surviving it. Just putting forth a concept here in this post, not trying to Mercola everyone into having 100 different phobias.
Doug,
I've heard about Brian Peskin but haven't really explored his work. I'll keep my eyes peeled. Hope you find something here that helps you out. There's no doubt in my mind that whatever your health condition may be, the healing of that condition is all that much more likely when your body temperature, heart rate, blood circulation, and hormones are up to par – which is what we're achieving, and will be fine-tuning over the months and years to come.
Kirk-
You're right. But if you can get similar results with Iodoral, I'd feel pretty bad forcing everyone to go on the milk diet to get the same impact. Nah mean?
Madmuhh-
Lugol's solution is fine too. I notice a big surge in heart rate from taking large amounts of kelp as well. Can't sleep at night if I take it too late in the day. A good sign for using that as a weapon in the metabolic arsenal.
Can you overdose on iodine? Is there maybe a cheaper brand you can get from the Vitamin Shop?
You know, thinking about it, when I spend time in Italy I eat tons of fish so get lots of iodine and spend most of my time in the ocean, so absorbing iodine. My skin, mood, nails, and hair are always fantastic when I am there and I always lose weight even though stuffing myself, so I suppose it might be the iodine.
“spend most of my time in the ocean, so absorbing iodine.” I don’t think you can absorb iodine from sea water, very low levels of iodine in sea water.
If you have specific questions about using iodine, I'd recommend emailing Dr. Poppy and asking her for her response.
poppydaniels@msn.com
Seems like taking the 12.5 mg Iodoral dose is the optimal dose for bringing up iodine levels the fastest.
thanks for the tips :) I shall get the solution like Madmuhh as I am in Europe :)
Where do eggs fit in when it comes to watching out for omega 6 consumption? What's a good amount of eggs to eat? Great site, BTW.
John
About iodine — be careful out there! For anyone with thyroid troubles, it can be very volatile, pushing you hypo and hyper very quickly. I experimented with both Lugol's and Iodoral and every time I would feel terrific for a few days and then WHAM! into a death spiral that took a long time to recover from. I've been taking Iodoral for about a year now, having worked up super slowly using NOW potassium iodide tablets.
Iodine is really great stuff but take it easy if your health is at all shaky.
This PUFA business is making me sad. I've got a freezer full of Polyface chickens that I plan to eat, licking my fingers and chomping on that tasty skin, and I hate doing that under a cloud. But the real bummer is that peanut butter is one of my boy's main food groups, and having taken away gluten and sugar, I just don't think I can add PB to the banned list, at least not now. He's such a picky eater already. He won't even eat spoonbread, the loon!
I hate it when unprocessed whole food gets the finger.
Like I said. Didn't want to spook anyone out of eating perfect pastured Polyface poultry. It's far more nutritious and well-balanced with omega 3's. Eggs fall into that category as well. Great if they are pastured – more worth the extra money for good eggs than any other food, the conclusion of a conversation I had with Aurora last night driving home from Costco :)
No spoonbread! What's wrong with that kid!
He'll be fine with some quality peanut butter. Just keep the friggin' vegetable oils out of the diet. You are right to suspect that unprocessed whole food is probably incapable of causing health problems. Polyface chickens are the LAST thing you need to worry about.
And thanks for the iodine tip. From what I understand it can cause massive detox reactions from stored halides – yet another reason to take it, flushing out flourine, chlorine, etc. that displaces our beloved iodine.
John-
Eat as many eggs as you want dear friend. But if you're really going to eat a lot of eggs, make sure they are quality eggs from outdoor chickens eating bugs, grubs, and worms. Like I said, I think the quality difference is more apparent in veg-fed eggs and pastured eggs than can be found in almost any other food.
madMUHHH, been doing 38 mg, Iosol, which is ammonium iodide and iodine, almost the same as Lugol. I've been doing it for almost 2 weeks. It has been no panacea, but it has helped. At the start, it made me feel hyper, I almost didn't sleep, but it passed. I'll up the dose to the max = 50 mg today. It is almost surprising that this wasn't THAT effective since I live very far from the sea and in a very high altitude (Bogota). I'm male, so no way of reporting what can Iodine do to your melons. Aren't you male too?
Matt, I very much doubt Iodine added to HED can replace something like the milk diet. That or things don't look that pretty for me.
@EL66K: Yes, I am male. It's just that as far as I'm concerned females need more iodine as quite some stuff is going into the mammary glands. So I thought it would be smart to know whether you're male or female as this puts it into a better context for me and help me deciding on what exact dose to take. I'm certainly gonna start out slow. Took one drop today, might take none at all tomorrow, as I don't wanna overwhelm my body, because I think there was already some slight detox going on with me today.
Great post!! This is really good info to have. It's so important to know what you eating, what you need, and what you don't need. Thank you for sharing!
Jen :)
madMUHHH, I got what you meant. Lugol's seems the cure for fribrocystic breasts, and womans may need more that males, specially if there are babaies involved, but as far as I know, 50 mg is the ideal for otho iodosupplementation (what a name…), or for obtaining full body saturation and detoxing whatever is there stopping your thyroid, and must be sustained for a while if the protocol is to be followed. One more thing, start slowly if you want, but I'm sure the longer you stay at low doses, the longer the "detox" will take, if there is much to be done. Of course, one thing is your body and thyroid starting up (people who go a long time with iodine deficiency may suffer from temporal hyperthyroidism when they start recieving big doses), and other thing is the idea of detoxing halides and other stuff. Thinking on that, maybe going slower would have absolved me of some hyper days, but I don't really care.
Da'Drooooo,
Could the people who died 20% more on omega-3 have died of infections? There has been stuff in the press about fish oil being associated with more severe lung infections, which is why I'd stopped supplementing (mainly out of concern for one of my daughters, who I'm breastfeeding and who was hospitalized with a lung infection last spring).
It could be, like a lot of nutrients, that omega-3's are something that it's essential to have, but where "the dose makes the poison." The research you remember reading reinforces to me the importance of looking at the "death from all causes" column in studies looking at any substance's effect on a specific disease.
I'm a little confused about finding the ideal intake, since reintroducing it immediately reversed some bad things that had been creeping up, like dental plaque, which I never usually have. I already have a very low omega-6 diet.
You just need a modest amount. I wouldn't try to exclude it from your diet by any means. Omega 3 has important functions to take advantage of, and is found in large amounts in Mother's milk for a reason.
Fish a couple times per week on a low omega 6 diet would probably be the perfect combo.
I had really BAD detox symptoms on Idoral but I may have pushed the dosage too fast. I broke out in huge whelp like hives on my trunk that itched like poison ivy. Once I stopped the Idoral, they began to go away but left red almost scar like marks behind for weeks. Could I be that toxic? Is is the flouride in the tap water? Am I just sensitive? I'l looking forward to your experiment Matt and the experiences of others.
Thanks for the reassurance, Matt. We of the Heinous Metabolism can get a little jumpy sometimes. :)
I would like to try to Iodine loading or supplementation but I am currently nursing my son and I'm afraid that detoxing might mess up my breastmilk. I don't want my son to take in all the crap my body is trying to get rid of. Lately, I've just been putting alot of iodized salt on everything. What do y'all think I should do?
One more question, does it matter if I microwave my food to re-heat it? Am I destroying nutrients?
"Btw, what the heck is 'spoonbread'???? Puzzled Brit here."
This has become like a drinking game: do a shot every someone mentions spoonbread.
I know Matt answered your question but if you're a Brit you are probably familiar with Yorkshire pudding. Spoonbread is actually quite similar using cornmeal instead of flour. It doesn't puff up quite as much (though there are probably recipes that have some leavening in them). You could even add tallow or dripping instead of butter I think to get a more "meaty" savory flavor. I used up all my Christmas dripping (time for another roast, I guess) but otherwise I'd try that. I think in the South where the dish originates they probably used bacon fat or lard originally. (I seem to remember something in Huck Finn about spoon bread, IIRC).
April,
You're probably best to just add a little kelp to your diet or take a kelp tablet or two per day for now. Later on, when it's just you that you're eating for, you can play around with this iodine thing.
Microwaving is certainly a 'hot' topic, no pun intended. It's not a good habit, but let's not get too paranoid here.
I'm a little overwhelmed by all the kelp and iodine supplements on the internet. What about kelp flakes/granules? Do they really contain alot of iodine? Do they taste ok? I live in a rural area so I have to order anything like this on the internet. Any suggestions on what brand to order? Thanks for answering my questions!
Kelp has mucho iodine. I guess for megadosing Dr. Brownstein, the godfather of iodine, recommends "cleaner" versions like iodoral or lugol's solution. I don't have any brand recommendations for you. Probably doesn't matter that much, but it will get you a nice amount of natural source iodine for your thyroid to play with.
Hey – I haven't seen anyone mention that WAP was very clear about taking the CLO together with butter (saturated fat), that they work better together.
Nice comments, I think I will hit the health store tomorrow, see if I can't find some iodine up here in Canada.
I have read about issues that Nell had posted too; all is good, then big crash after up'ing iodine.
I will start slow and see how it goes as well.
I drink about 1cup raw milk per, going to start up'ing that as well.
that's 1cup raw milk / day
I just purchased a big bucket of grassfed beef tallow so as to have a decent cooking oil. It's cheaper than grassfed butter so I use the tallow for cooking, coconut oil for baking, & the butter for table use.
You know, you can saute your sadly skinless chicken and even pork with this tallow & it tastes superb! Also for special occasions it makes the flakiest pie crust ever.
I looked at three different grocery stores for macadamia nuts today. Not a single macadamia nut in any of them!
Saw enough cashews to bury Brazil.
I've got mac nuts and mac nut oil in my little Amazon store now, wink wink.
Velcromom (great handle, btw) wrote:
"You know, you can saute your sadly skinless chicken and even pork with this tallow & it tastes superb! Also for special occasions it makes the flakiest pie crust ever."
This sounds awesome. I was just asking about pie crust the other day. Where did you get so much tallow. I usually horde mine from making stock but it doesn't amount to more than a few tablespoons per batch.
I've been really getting into creamed chicken. I honestly think I prefer it to fried and that's saying something. I really, really like fried chicken. It's one of the few foods I've given up that I actually miss.
I have baked with coconut oil before and it works great, but what if you want to bake with an oil without the coconut flavor? Is there an alternative? And what about peanut and walnut oils? What kind of oil is best to use for stir fry?
Love the oil topic, but I usually seem so confused! Thanks for any help.
Jenny:
How do you make creamed chicken? Can you share your recipe?
Use refined/expeller pressed coconut oil for baking, frying, sauteeing, and other heat adventures. I've got a bucket of totally odorless and flavorless coconut oil in my little Amazon shop now. 31 bucks for a whole gallon. I'll never eat extra virgin coconut oil again. Rarf!!!
Not all poultry is high in omega-6. Duck and goose fat are about 11-13% omega-6, similar to pork fat. If you can find pork leaf fat, that is just 8% PUFAs, about the same as lamb. Olive oil ranges from 7-14% PUFAs, or 1-2g per tablespoon, based on labels I've seen. I prefer Mac Nut Oil.
i would put eggs on the really good list too?
But aren't the refined oils worse for you than the unrefined oils? Does that not apply to all oils?
Thanks!
Mel
Refined polyunsaturated and to a lesser degree monounsaturated oils are much more harmful for you than unrefined versions. That's because those are very sensitive and unstable fats – that oxidize when exposed to heat, light, air, etc.
Coconut oil is so stable, due to it's highly saturated nature, that you can refine it, heat it, keep it on your counter for a year… whatever. It can take it without forming harmful free radicals. That why refined coconut oil = fine
Refined liquid oils = bad
Matt,
First time poster……..I'm hoping you take a closer look at Brian Peskin's work. He is totally in support of omega 6's, as long as they are unrefined and organic. He makes a mix of sunflower and safflower oils and downs a couple of shots a day. Has perfect blood work. He is totally against fish oil supplements even for inflammation. Says 6's are better. Anyway I found his work interesting and hoping you check it out. Thanks
Dan Holt
I personally am very skeptical about purchasing unshelled nuts. I don't know whether or not being unshelled and sitting at room temperature is bad for them or not. Being that I found these shelled macadamia nuts for $5 a pound. That's a good deal if you ask me. I'd rather do that. I like shelled nuts better as it is because they preserve that fresh natural delicious flavor. Shelled unroasted unsalted peanuts are the bomb too. I would like to hear your opinion on this choice of macadamia nuts. The next option would be to find out if it is organic:
http://www.nutsonline.com/nuts/macadamianuts/in-shell.html'source=googlebase
Dan Holt
I've read that olive oil has the higher smoke point. Does that mean olive oil is better to cook at even higher temperatures with than coconut oil? I would assume coconut oil would be best to cook at the highest temps with because it is highest in saturated fat content. Olive oil is mostly monounsaturated fat. Saturated fat is supposed to be composed of a more solid structure than mono fat, as mono fat has a broken chain in it. I would assume coconut oil is better to cook with than beef suet because suet contains cholesterol and cholesterol denatures at higher heats.
Thanks
Dan Holt
I read a mention of body temperature in this thread. I've read 98.6 degrees f is the proper temperature but you can only find it out if you stick a thermometer up a person's rectum.
Thanks
My source for grassfed tallow is US Wellness meats. :)
Oats have a high concentration of omega-6. The omega-6 is 5.6% of its overall calories. Corn has a similar ratio of 5.3%.
Buckwheat has the highest with 8% of its Calories as omega-6. In my opinion, buckwheat should be avoided.
That's for whole buckwheat, which few eat. Most stores, even health food stores, don't even sell it.
Groats (kasha) is less than 2% omega 6.
Oats do have a small amount of GLA as well, which may be a factor – preventing the omega 6 from being converted into inflammatory Arachidonic Acid. Many foods have qualities like that, such as olive oil and sesame oil (sesamin).
I was wrong. I found out that buckwheat has only 2.5% of its Calories as omega-6, according to the USDA nutrient database. So it's better than oats.
I love making "kefir cream," AKA sour cream made with kefir grains. This is one of my favorite fat sources.
It's exactly like making kefir with milk, except you use cream. On Dom's kefir in-site he used freshly strained kefir added to heavy cream to make the sour cream, but I've found that I prefer using spare kefir grains.
I also second the recommendations for red (virgin) palm oil. I prefer getting it from Tropical Traditions; I love that company, and I'm always for supporting good causes.
Anyway, the red palm oil is packed with vitamin A and E, and if I remember right, also CoQ10 and a host of other nutrients. It is definitely the most nutrient dense fat.
I think variety is the king here, but with that in mind, red palm oil is certainly a good addition to this list in my opinion. And the fun with dairy never ends ;) I'd say more about viili, matsoni, and kefir-cultured wonders but I don't want to get too caught up in that now XD
As always, thanks for the insightful post, and it's always a joy to hear what you have to say and to read through the comments and find out what everyone else has to say as well. Love it!
EDIT: The most nutritionally dense fat *that I'm aware of at this point in time.*
"Definite" is a word I'm trying to use less these days, outside of talking about my own personal convictions on more subjective things. Just had to throw that in there.
Wow, I've been eating peanut butter in vast amounts for way too long and I jst stopped. Thanks.
However… I don't know about your omega-3 fat recommendation, or lack of it. I was on another blog and I found this study
http://www.jlr.org/content/43/10/1743.long
Omega-3 fats, from flax, increased saturated fatty acid composition in plasma and in the milk fats… hmm? I don't know how good that study is and I need to look for more. Pce
I am thinking I have inflamation in my knees due to getting too much fat in my diet. For years I took 3 soup spoons of Cod Liver oil every morning, was eating nuts, oils on my salad etc. Research has revealed that Omega 6 can cause inflamation. However, I seem to be having issues with any type of fat, Ghee, coconut oil you name it. I am trying to eat fat free, am noticing improvements in my knees but I still have discomfort. The Dr. says surgery is not my answer. How long can it take to reverse the problem if it is due to oil saturation in my body? How long should the fats be avoided after (am hoping the pain will go away) the pain has been eliminated? Thanks for your help.